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 Post subject: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:14 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2006 7:53 pm
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Location: Diane Richardson, Unity, New Hampshire
A friend asked me this question and i don't know the answer

Can a dog from a Country where docking is legal be imported INTO a docking forbidden country AND be shown/bred?

IE from US to England

or

Canada to Holland?

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Diane Richardson
The Dogs of Frontier

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Bill HICs, TT
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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:08 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:28 pm
Posts: 203
Location: Ann Felske-Jackman, Ontario, Canada
We sent Deke (www.esmondrott.com/deke.htm) to Australia this year and he is eligible to be shown and bred.

However, we also looked into sending a puppy to Thomas Schaff, for all of his help training Yngo, and he was told that the dog would be ineligible for the BST, and thus, for breeding. We decided to wait until we left tails on a litter to send him a pup. In our opinion, there was no point in limiting the dog's career after working so hard to get him into the right home.

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Ann Felske-Jackman
Multi V-1, Sieger, Multi BISS Am/Can CH Yngo van het Dornedal Am/Can CDX, TDX, SchHIII, FH, BST, BH, TT, CGC
V-1 Multi BOSS Am/Can/UKC CH Esmonds Iza One and Only Am/Can CDX, TDX, SchHIII, FH2, IPOIII, BST, AD, BH, TT, CGC


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 3:39 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:04 pm
Posts: 817
Location: Dana McMahan (Williams), California
Now what if the dog's BST was then done in a country that was okay with docking? So the dog could live and breed in one country, get his BST and be bred/docked in another....?

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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 6:59 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 4:50 pm
Posts: 143
Location: Ruben Pina, Los Angeles, CA
Any dog can be exported from US or Canada and be bred...just cant be shown in a banned docking country............ with or without the BST

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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 9:45 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:55 pm
Posts: 905
Location: Tommy Stark, St. Simons Island GA
can't show a docked dog in a country that follows FCI standard.

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Tommy Stark
von der Stark

Multi V-1, Multi Y. Sieger, BOB, BOG, NIRK Y.Ch. Konigliche Bhaji v.d. Stark CGC, RN, HIT(s), HIC, TDI, RTD, ARV BBT, CHIC #66928

V1 Rated, 2x BOG, r.BOG, First Choice v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1, RN, HIT(s), HIC, CGC, TDI, RTD, CHIC #65530

Multi V-1 First Class v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1 cardiac-normal, OFA "Good"

Multi V-1, 9x BOB Ara Brcko Star HD-A/ED-0 cardiac-normal *retired*

Imma von der Stark


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 9:47 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 5:56 pm
Posts: 509
Location: Gretchen Caldwell, Massachusetts
I'd also be willing to bet that while the docked dog (in a country requiring tails) "could" be bred.......puppies wouldn't be FCI registerable.

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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 9:58 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 1:28 pm
Posts: 203
Location: Ann Felske-Jackman, Ontario, Canada
They can definitely be shown, bred and have pups registered in Australia. We did have to supply documentation stating that Deke was docked before export however. I believe it's the same in England. No sure about other countries.

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Ann Felske-Jackman
Multi V-1, Sieger, Multi BISS Am/Can CH Yngo van het Dornedal Am/Can CDX, TDX, SchHIII, FH, BST, BH, TT, CGC
V-1 Multi BOSS Am/Can/UKC CH Esmonds Iza One and Only Am/Can CDX, TDX, SchHIII, FH2, IPOIII, BST, AD, BH, TT, CGC


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 10:02 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:55 pm
Posts: 905
Location: Tommy Stark, St. Simons Island GA
yes they can....Gil is docked and can be bred and pups registered in all countries. he also has ZtP though...so maybe he was grandfathered in.....so if the sire or bitch was docked before the deadline for that country then they would be ok....but after that im not sure...

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Tommy Stark
von der Stark

Multi V-1, Multi Y. Sieger, BOB, BOG, NIRK Y.Ch. Konigliche Bhaji v.d. Stark CGC, RN, HIT(s), HIC, TDI, RTD, ARV BBT, CHIC #66928

V1 Rated, 2x BOG, r.BOG, First Choice v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1, RN, HIT(s), HIC, CGC, TDI, RTD, CHIC #65530

Multi V-1 First Class v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1 cardiac-normal, OFA "Good"

Multi V-1, 9x BOB Ara Brcko Star HD-A/ED-0 cardiac-normal *retired*

Imma von der Stark


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:27 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2007 3:29 am
Posts: 270
Location: Kathleen Vos, Belgium
von_der_stark wrote:
can't show a docked dog in a country that follows FCI standard.


@Tommy: The IFR Worldchampion female and BIS in Italy 2007 was docked.

From article" Another tale about the tail" by Dirk Vandecasteele
F C I - s h o w r e g u l a t i o n
(01.01.2008) that again leaves
some room for interpretation and
discussion : “Dogs with docked
tails or cropped ears are to be
admitted in accordance with the
legal regulations of their home
countries and those of the
country where the show takes
place. The judging of docked
and undocked or cropped and uncropped dogs must be done
without any discrimination and solely in accordance with the
valid breed standard”. The first sense is only about having to
allow docked dogs to participate a show or not. The second
part, however, is a directive for the judge. One interpretation
is that docked and undocked dogs must be judged alike,
without discrimination.
There is, however, the additive : “… solely in accordance with
the valid breed standard” that cannot be overlooked and that
suggests that docked and undocked dogs are only to be
judged alike when the breed standard allows both docked and
undocked tails. This would mean that if, as is the case for the
Rottweiler, the breed standard demands the tail to be left in
natural condition, the judge must take this into account ! The
IFR has until now read this directive in the sense that we
should not discriminate between docked and undocked dogs
(for example: the female IFR-world champion and best in show
2007 was docked) and as the FCI-breed standard does not list
the docked tail as a disqualifying deviation, this is also my
personal opinion. I admit though, that this can lead to an
unpleasant situation and even a blatant discrimination of an
undocked dog that is disqualified because of a faulty tail while
other dogs in the ring might have shown the same faulty tail …
had they not been docked!

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Kathleen Vos


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2007 3:29 am
Posts: 270
Location: Kathleen Vos, Belgium
IFR Siegerin and BIS 2007 Italy.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

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Kathleen Vos


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 4:31 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 3:59 pm
Posts: 39
Location: Bob Bolognesi, Riverside, California
XAMOS wrote:
IFR Siegerin and BIS 2007 Italy.



So are you saying that a docked dog born in the US would be allowed to show in the IFR this year without discrimination ?

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Bob Bolognesi


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 10:15 pm 
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:55 pm
Posts: 905
Location: Tommy Stark, St. Simons Island GA
oh that would be awesome if i could take a docked dog to the IFR this year!!! I have a bitch for working class that is docked.....

Kathleen......can i show a docked dog this year?

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Tommy Stark
von der Stark

Multi V-1, Multi Y. Sieger, BOB, BOG, NIRK Y.Ch. Konigliche Bhaji v.d. Stark CGC, RN, HIT(s), HIC, TDI, RTD, ARV BBT, CHIC #66928

V1 Rated, 2x BOG, r.BOG, First Choice v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1, RN, HIT(s), HIC, CGC, TDI, RTD, CHIC #65530

Multi V-1 First Class v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1 cardiac-normal, OFA "Good"

Multi V-1, 9x BOB Ara Brcko Star HD-A/ED-0 cardiac-normal *retired*

Imma von der Stark


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 7:55 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2007 3:29 am
Posts: 270
Location: Kathleen Vos, Belgium
von_der_stark wrote:
oh that would be awesome if i could take a docked dog to the IFR this year!!! I have a bitch for working class that is docked.....

Kathleen......can i show a docked dog this year?



@ Bob, Tommy and other people interested in this info:

Sorry for the delay in answering your question.
Italy RK asked ENCI opinion on this and let us know asap!
I keep you posted.

For those of you interested in entering the entryform is online since shortly.

Ciao, A presto,

Kathleen.

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Kathleen Vos


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 Post subject: Re: Importing a docked dog TO a no dock country
PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 8:25 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:55 pm
Posts: 905
Location: Tommy Stark, St. Simons Island GA
Thank you Kathleen!!! I hope ENCI says ok!!

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Tommy Stark
von der Stark

Multi V-1, Multi Y. Sieger, BOB, BOG, NIRK Y.Ch. Konigliche Bhaji v.d. Stark CGC, RN, HIT(s), HIC, TDI, RTD, ARV BBT, CHIC #66928

V1 Rated, 2x BOG, r.BOG, First Choice v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1, RN, HIT(s), HIC, CGC, TDI, RTD, CHIC #65530

Multi V-1 First Class v.d. Stark BH, IPO-1 cardiac-normal, OFA "Good"

Multi V-1, 9x BOB Ara Brcko Star HD-A/ED-0 cardiac-normal *retired*

Imma von der Stark


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